Cubs MLB Roster

Cubs Organizational Depth Chart
40-Man Roster Info

40 players are on the MLB RESERVE LIST (roster is full) 

28 players on MLB RESERVE LIST are ACTIVE, and twelve players are on OPTIONAL ASSIGNMENT to minors. 

Last updated 3-26-2024
 
* bats or throws left
# bats both

PITCHERS: 15
Yency Almonte
Adbert Alzolay 
Javier Assad
Jose Cuas
Kyle Hendricks
* Shota Imanaga
Caleb Kilian
Mark Leiter Jr
* Luke Little
Julian Merryweather
Hector Neris 
* Drew Smyly
* Justin Steele
Jameson Taillon
* Jordan Wicks

CATCHERS: 2
Miguel Amaya
Yan Gomes

INFIELDERS: 7
* Michael Busch 
Nico Hoerner
Nick Madrigal
* Miles Mastrobuoni
Christopher Morel
Dansby Swanson
Patrick Wisdom

OUTFIELDERS: 4
* Cody Bellinger 
Alexander Canario
# Ian Happ
Seiya Suzuki
* Mike Tauchman 

OPTIONED: 12 
Kevin Alcantara, OF 
Michael Arias, P 
Ben Brown, P 
Alexander Canario, OF 
Pete Crow-Armstrong, OF 
Brennen Davis, OF 
Porter Hodge, P 
* Matt Mervis, 1B 
Daniel Palencia, P 
Keegan Thompson, P 
Luis Vazquez, INF 
Hayden Wesneski, P 

 



 

Minor League Rosters
Rule 5 Draft 
Minor League Free-Agents

ESPN: Cubs Trade Barrett to San Diego

Buster Olney of ESPN is reporting that the Cubs have traded catcher Michael Barrett to the Padres in exchange for catcher Rob Bowen, a minor league pitcher and cash. Steve Stone, appearing on the Mike North Show (WSCR Radio in Chicago), at 9:00 a.m. local time, confirmed that Barrett was being traded, saying he (Stone) had spoken to a friend who had gotten off the phone with Barrett just minutes before. Stone also said that a source told him the Cubs had become "frustrated" with Barrett's inability to improve his defense over the past couple weeks, which led Stone to infer that the team was pursuing a deal. Stone pointed out that Jim Hendry avidly pursued Barrett during the catcher's years with the Expos and that Cubs player personnel exec Gary Hughes was also a huge Barrett supporter, having drafted him when Hughes was employed in Montreal. Mike North further reported that according to rumors that WSCR was hearing, the Cubs would be receiving Bowen and set-up man Scott Linebrink in return (different than what Olney's sources told him). Obviously, acquiring Linebrink in the swap would make the deal much more attractive from the Cubs' point of view. UPDATE (Rob G.): Olney got it right and the prospect is 19 yr old outfielder Kyler Burke, who you can read about over at "Road to Wrigley". As for our new catcher, Rob Bowen, a few scouting reports, the first from Sportsnet:
Assets: A switch-hitting catcher who excels from the left side, showing decent power. He's an above-average defensive catcher, able to block and throw very well. Flaws: He's a weak hitter from the right side and generally lacks discipline at the plate. Career potential: Good backup catcher who can be a No. 1 if needed.
And a 2004 scouting report from Baseball America I pulled off a message board:
He is solid defensively and is very agile behind the plate. He has a plus arm and has a quick release. He is also very adept at blocking balls in the dirt. Offensively, he has natural loft in his swing, which should lead to power potential. He is a switch hitter, but scouts like him better from the left side.
Essentially the Cubs are taking another shot at a raw player on the right side of 30. His caught stealing rates are pretty bad over the last few years but those can depend a lot on your pitching staff. Offensively, at least he can take a walk. At worst, we've got a much better #2 catcher as Henry Blanco's career looks in jeopardy. At best, Bowen finds his groove and we've got a relatively cheap new #1 catcher for the next three years.

Comments

Barrett is going to a 1st place team... http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/6941994 The Cubs, frustrated by Michael Barrett's erratic, inattentive play, have traded the catcher to the Padres, FOXSports.com has confirmed. The Cubs received catcher Rob Bowen, minor-league outfielder Kyler Burke and cash.The Padres, eighth in the National League in runs, have been searching for more offense. They are second in the league in on-base/slugging percentage at catcher, but Barrett would be an offensive upgrade over Josh Bard and Bowen. Defense is another question. Barrett, a converted infielder, had improved behind the plate in recent years but struggled with his defense and base-running this season. From that standpoint, his addition could be a risk to the Padres, who lead the NL with a 2.97 ERA. When Cubs pitcher Carlos Zambrano pointed to his head in the moments leading to his brawl with Barrett, apparently questioning what the catcher was thinking, it captured the team's frustration with Barrett's play. ESPN.com broke the initial trade story early Wednesday morning. Barrett, 30, is batting .256 with nine homers and 29 RBIs.

SD is hosting Balt., so Michael and Korey can get together and bitch tonight.

Not a terrible return, but still not in Linebrink territory. So long, Michael, and may you tan in the SoCal sun -- you certainly need it.

I think its a pipe dream that we get Scott Linebrink. i know nothing about Bowen - from his stats the guy has seen limited action. I just hope he is a very good catcher otherwise this trade is a giveaway.

Hopefully Fontenot continues to hit well into the year, and Floyd's legs don't fall off because that's the drop off from Aram and Lee now. Cant wait to see JJ, Bowen and Neifizzy in a lineup soon. ~barf~

Jim: You take all my high-priced headaches off my hands, we'll give you a bunch of money and you don't have to give much back in return. Kevin: I'll take your catcherand the money, but forget the rest of these bums. Jim: In that case, can I get Linebrink? Kevin: No. Jim: ..... OK.

ZHL: "Michael and Korey can get together and bitch tonight." That was uncalled for. Corey didn't bitch. Leave him alone.

Another important fact: Bowen's '07 salary: $382,000 Barrett's '07 salary: $4,500,000 I doubt the cash considerations were 4 million dollars.

As dave reported in the other thread (quoting Road to Wrigley), Colvin moving to AA. Two thoughts: 1) Tennessee is a phone call from Wrigley, as Sean Gallagher can attest. 2) Josh Kroeger plays right for Tennessee. Is he moving up, and if so, one level or two? I love player movement! We also heard this morning that the Cubs are trying to move Izturis, which makes sense but hadn't yet been reported.

Okay.....big stretch on this one....but as much as TCR et al analyze the Cubs, Minnesoooooootans do the same to the Twins. You know I just moved to Mankato, and I'm AMAZED to hear constant scrutiny of Joe Mauer.....basically copmparing him to Prior in terms of his lack of toughness. I think the term labia boy was used last night in the bar. SOMEONE on TCR mentioned the Twins are looking to trade for Jock "Duke" Jones. The Cubs could package JJ, a young arm (Marshall) and a pile of money for Mauer. Let's throw THAT in Madonna's bed and see if she sleeps with it. Joey, from Mankato

That 89 OPS will look super nice along side Izturis, Jones and the pitcher. Hits will abound!

The Cubs could package JJ, a young arm (Marshall) and a pile of money for Mauer. You have to be kidding me... why aren't the Cubs asking for Santana also? Maybe the Cubs can also trade for Jose Reyes to play SS, Beltran for CF, Utley for 2b, and Vlad Guerrero in RF? And if we must, maybe the Cubs could make a run at Justin Verlander, Jake Peavy, and Dan Haren while they are at it.

Dave, Not kidding you at all.......I have no clue WHAT the Cubs would have to give up, and don't really care. I'm just telling you what I heard anectdotally in the geographic area around here, and throwing something in Madonna's bed to chew on...insert pun there. The Twins are APPARENTLY wondering if Mauer fits in long term. Joey

I would be completely shocked if Mauer gets traded any time in the next few years. And if he did... it most definitely would take more than JJ, Marshall, and cash.

Dave, I wouldn't be shocked if he got traded, but it's only a gut feeling. I agree......though...that it will take something substantial to get him.

ZHL: Muskat gets her report up, speculates that Hill will become the starter. I just threw up a little in my mouth.

hope Muskat is wrong, at least Bowen gets on base.... don't know much about his defense though.

Rob... his defense has been very unimpressive in the bigs - only throwing out 3 of 31 base stealers. And his pb rate is pretty similar to Barrett's this year. But allegedly scouting reports say his defense is good.

nice they got a catcher who's under 30 and about 3 yrs of service time left and at least could be a #1 catcher. His power numbers should be helped by getting out of Petco as well. interesting move to make at this point but TCR should be far friendlier. :) get rid of JJ and Izturis and they'll be nothing to bitch about.

joey from mankato, that is the most ridiculous stuff I've read in quite some time. you had a few too many at the bar if you believe that. maybe the barstool pundits in mankato think that way, but the twins sure as shit don't, nor do most twins fans. (if you need "local" credentials, I live in minneapolis). with hunter gone after this year, mauer will be the face of the franchise for the next few years as they move into the new stadium. he's a local kid, and one of two or three young building-block players most GMs would jump on if they had to start a franchise. don't equate some silly comments by torii hunter and musings by some idiot fans for how twins management feels.

Now we are going to bitch about how well barrett is playing in SD and how the hell did Hendry give him away for essentially nothing. Of course... from the looks of it, we will also have Bowen to bitch about.

if we're wondering why Bowen was released twice before he reached the Padres, the Twins tried to get him through waivers and the Tigers claimed him and then the Tigers tried to do the exact same thing but the Padres claimed him.

But Rob - those teams could have pulled him back off of waivers if they wanted, right? So he was obviously not someone those teams were too excited about. But good to hear the Cubs could have gotten Bowen for nothing instead of for a Silver Slugger catcher.

Last night during the game they ran a promo for the upcoming "Michael Barrett Jersey Night." As I watched it I thought, "OK, now Barrett's definitely getting traded." How weird. Will it now be "Koyie Hill Jersey Night" for 100 random winners?

I'm not a scout, but while we're on the topic of catchers, is there a reason why Soto hasn't been, or won't, be given a chance to show what he can do? I know he's not a great prospect. But he's always hit relatively decently, is hitting the ball real well this year, and I seem to recall hearing that his defense was good. He may not project to be much more than a backup catcher, but it seems like the cubs have those in spades, and getting another one in bowen seems odd.

I'll give you the passed balls, alright. Fine. Catch the baesball. But you cannot place blame for the baserunning numbers on him. No catcher in baseball could be successful with the pitching staff the Padres have. I don't even remember who the Twins had in the rotation when he caught all of 18 games (HUGE sample, by the way). Let's see. I bet there was a Lohse. I bet there was a Radke in there. Neither of those scream "IT WAS THE CATCHER'S FAULT!" I think there was even a Mulholland in there for a while. Throwing out baserunners is impossible when you have pitchers who don't do a good job of holding runners on. I don't even know who he caught, but that grouping of pitchers tells me that if it wasn't Santana, it was tough on him. The scout on whether or not a guy has a good throwing arm from behind the plate is very rarely incorrect. It doesn't change suddenly. If he was good at AA and AAA, he'll be good in the bigs. At least give him a fighting chance with a rotation of 3 lefties and two power pitchers before you write his arm off for good.

hmm, I believe he was a 40-man roster casualty at the time, that they wanted to keep in the organization but didn't want to continue to keep on the 40-man. I don't think it's irrevocable, that's an AZ Phil question though. At best, we get our #1 catcher for the next few years, at worse we got a far better #2 catcher than Blanco who's career may be done anyway. But Koyie Hill really sucks, please don't give him the job.

Wes — June 20, 2007 @ 8:28 am SD Union Tribune reporting the PTBN is lo-A outfielder Kyler Burke. 19 year old. 35th overall pick last year out of high school. BP says he’s the 9th best prospy in the Pads system. Scout on him includes an excellent throwing arm from right-field and tremendous power. Struggling to hit pro pitching so far, though. ================================ WES: The Cubs are loaded with left-handed hitting OFs up-and-down their system (Colvin, Fuld, Andersen, Rundle, Camp, Leclerc, Wyatt, Sommer, and N. Perez, plus Clark Hardman if the Cubs can sign him) ,all of whom are as good or better than Kyler Burke (and I have seen Burke play, in AZL '06 and ST '07). So I think it is VERY likely that the Cubs will assign Burke to AZL Mesa where he will be converted to LHP (he was an OF/P coming out of HS, and some teams projected him as an outfielder, while others projected him as a pitcher). The one thing that impressed me about Burke was his OF arm. Otherwise, he is a mess. And while the Cubs do not need any more left-handed OFs, they DO need LHPs. (Of the 19 pitchers assigned to AZL Mesa, one, repeat--ONE, is a LHP). It's not unusual for the Cubs to convert a position player to pitcher (most notably Carlos Marmol, but also Randy Wells, Federico Baez, Adalberto Mendez, Brandon Taylor, Leonel Perez, Alfredo Francisco, and Carlos Bernard, and--in EXST '07--Blake Parker), so it would not be odd for the Cubs to do the same with Burke. They may do it with Ryan Harvey (who has the best OF arm in the organization and threw in the mid-90's off the mound in HS) one of these days, too.

Does anyone else think that Hendry might have something else up his sleeve in the short term? Maybe unloading Barrett's $4 mil (or most of it presumably) gives him a bit of leeway to make a move that might add to the payroll. I'd hope for a SS or RF. Otherwise, this does seem like a desperation move to get rid of an unpopular guy for little in return. And maybe that's really all it is.

Burke was a 1st round pick last year. It seems far fetched to think they are going to put him on the mound now? If Ryan Harvey can suck it up for 4 years in the system. I would think that Burke has at least 2 years to prove he sucks before the conversion. At least in my opinion.

In a somewhat related note. What are the TCR rules regarding the blaming of players no longer on the roster? Is it poor form to Blame Barrett while his is in San Diego?

Burke was a 1st round pick last year. It seems far fetched to think they are going to put him on the mound now? Why is it far fetched? AZ Phil already pointed out the several other players who have been moved to the mound, but you also need to remember that Burke was also a highly touted pitcher coming out of high school. SD made the decision to have him focus on playing the OF - the Cubs could decide to have him pitch instead.

Obviously Barrett can hurt our team even while in San Diego. Just remember that every time Bowen doesn't throw out a baserunner it's Barrett's fault.

You don't have to poke too deep to uncover a possible Barrett/Padres conspiracy from mere days ago. If anything, the sinister shadows around Barrett are lengthening.

Good point Dave. I guess the main reason for questioning switching Burke is that he is only 20...it's not like he's stalled at Lo-A for 3 seasons. Either way....meh.

Yeah, but if you are going to change someone's position, wouldn't you do it as young as possible?

Doug D- I was thinking the same thing about Barrett. I nominate Dempster as TCR's undeserving whipping boy

That explains the pitcher/Burke discrepancies. That also explains why I will keep coming to this site for my Cubs news... Phil da man. Of course we can still blame Barrett. Don't be silly.

Rob G. — June 20, 2007 @ 9:27 am if we’re wondering why Bowen was released twice before he reached the Padres, the Twins tried to get him through waivers and the Tigers claimed him and then the Tigers tried to do the exact same thing but the Padres claimed him. ============================= ROB G: Rob Bowen was out of minor league options as of ST 2006, and he was claimed off waivers by DET when the Twins tried to outright him to the minors at the end of ST that year ('06). Then the Tigers tried to outright him to the minors immediately after they claimed him, but the Padres claimed him and kept him on their 25-man roster for the entire 2006 season and so far in 2007. And Koyie Hill is in the exact same position right now (like Bowen, Hill is out of minor league options). The Cubs will face a similar problem with Geovany Soto and Ronny Cedeno next ST (2008), as both will be out of minor league options at that time.

With Cesar almost definitely gone, it shouldn't be too hard to find a spot for Ronny, unless Hendry has plans to re-sign Neifi.

So we trade away Barrett for nothing, with basically no real starting cather to take his place. Looks like they really want to keep Z happy, so bye bye barrett. F Hendry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cubs should have traded Hendry not Barrett. this Bowen freak isn't major league.

the cubs.com story says minor league pitcher fwiw... no mention of Burke....

Hendry has to find another trade partner to upgrade the offense at some other position... Even with Barrett not performing up to his last couple years, this is an offensive downgrade any way you slice it. K.Hill is not a hitting catcher, and this Bowen guy is unproven and has a relatively SMALL sample size. There needs to be a trade involving JJones and/or Izzy to upgrade offensively at some position (SS, 2B, C, RF? although Floyd in RF is temporarily OK). Unfortunately, this will probably require packaging some young guns along with those two older pieces of trash.

So I think my theory of players taking sides after the Z/Barrett fight looks pretty right on. And unfortunately for Barrett, it doesn't look like he had much support with his teammates, especially after the Hill argument too.

former pitcher and Cy Young winner Steve Stone thinks it's a bad trade for the Cubs...Stone said this morning on a Chicago sports radio station that the Cubs didn't get enough back in the trade and that it would be very difficult to replace Barrett (and his bat).

CWTP: "Cubs should have traded Hendry not Barrett. this Bowen freak isn’t major league." AMEN!!!

The tone reminds me of the reaction to trading for Barrett instead of signing PudgeRod. How did that one turn out? Honestly, the Cubs got the less productive player and paid a lot less for him too. Win for Tribune, loss for Cubs.

Rob, like Phil posted, I think maybe Burke IS the minor league pitcher. I was trying to crack that nut all morning.

former pitcher and Cy Young winner Steve Stone wait... steve stone is a former pitcher and cy young winner? who knew? and when is the last time steve stone said ANYTHING positive a move that the cubs made?

"this Bowen guy is unproven" I'll tell you what he's proven. He's proven that he strikes out way more often than he hits safely. If you loved KKKorey you'll love Bowen.

Rob G.: "wtf are you talking about manny?" I think Barrett might of lost his teammates after the Z fight and Hill argument. Like I said, just a theory, which of course I am sure you will disagree. But this trade was not made to upgrade the team, that is obvious.

Bowen 268/371/439 age 26 Barrett 256/307/427 age 30 sure Barrett's got more going for him for the bat over the last few years and he's been warming up lately, but at the very least it's a lefty bat with some patience. and depending on the money, which is at least over a $1 million, there's probably some room to make another deal if needed.

But this trade was not made to upgrade the team, that is obvious. Well that depends. While I am a big Barrett fan, he is made a numerous boneheaded plays that simply do not show up anywhere in stats. The Cubs may feel that they simply cannot deal with his mental lapses and poor defense anymore. From all appearances, Barrett has been fine with Z and all of the other pitchers on the team. I really do no think that it had anything to do with players "picking sides" or "loosing teammates" or anything like that.

Jim Hendry continues to demonstrate he is unfit for command...top tier GMs (like Dave Dombrowski and Walt Jocketty) would never have done this trade with the Padres...I'm quite sure that the new owners of the Cubs will bring in a new GM - that might be one of the first decisions that they make.

I think Barrett might of lost his teammates after the Z fight and Hill argument. Like I said, just a theory, which of course I am sure you will disagree. But this trade was not made to upgrade the team, that is obvious. You think that based off absolutely nothing and your theory is full of s***. How about read the parts where his teammates backed Barrett up? and if Bowen is a defensive upgrade which he sounds like, how is it not to help the team or at the very least a lateral move that might help take on salary in July? He's also hitting better this year than Barrett (sure in limited time) in a very unfriendly hitting environment.

Come on Rob... do you really think that is a fair comparison? Barrett has obviously slumped offensively for most of the year, but he as also pretty clearly been coming out of that slump (and you have said so yourself). Bowen isn't nearly the offensive player that Barrett is.

Given that Jim Hendry and Gary Hughes are big Michael Barrett fans, I would think this move (exchanging Barrett for a different catcher) was something Lou Piniella requested/demanded at the clubhouse meeting with the bosses at Wrigley Field a couple of weeks ago. Hendry probably told Uncle Lou to keep playing Barrett as often as he could stand it (to keep his trade value as high as possible), while he (Hendry) would work on making a deal. Probably the same thing is happening with Jacque Jones and Scott Eyre.

I'll have to agree with Stoney on this one, but it was only slightly in the San Diego Madres favor. By now Barrett should be thought of as a rental and he hasn't really added a lot of value to the Cub's this year anyways.

If Bowen is an upgrade over Barrett, why were the Cubs also able to get a prospect and salary relief? From an outsider's point of view this seems to be a straight dump of Barrett, which may not be such a bad thing.

Bowen isn’t nearly the offensive player that Barrett is. This year? no... Going forward? Bowen's 26 with patience, chances are his better years are coming. Remember where Barrett was when we traded for him? I wouldn't be suprised if Bowen/Barrett hit about the same over the next 3 years.

dave: ...plays that simply do not show up anywhere in stats. I'm so proud of you!!! :)))

"Bowen 268/371/439 age 26 Barrett 256/307/427 age 30 sure Barrett’s got more going for him for the bat over the last few years and he’s been warming up lately, but at the very least it’s a lefty bat with some patience. and depending on the money, which is at least over a $1 million, there’s probably some room to make another deal if needed." C'mon Rob, how dare you look at this trade objectively, with number and stuff...

I think it is clear that Barrett's miscues were quite a drag on the team. We get a better defensive catcher, with much better patience at the plate, along with a prospect that has a chance of contributing a few years down the line. While this does, no doubt, hurt the Cubs offensively, I do think that it puts them in position to make other moves without adding to their payroll. I would like to see those moves made soon, though.

I keep hearing references to Bowen's patience at the plate, but the scouting reports say he has poor plate discipline.

I'm not thrilled with the trade or anything, but obviously the organization was fed up with Barrett's boneheaded plays just like most fans and were definitely not planning to resign him. Might as well get something and it's not like the rest of the league isn't aware of Barrett's deficinies (sp?). They all get Sportscenter.

I’m so proud of you!!! :))) Thanks... glad you approve. But while I like stats and find them incredibly valuable for evaluating players, I also have never denied that there are other issues - things like dropped foul pop-ups, base running blunders, etc that often cannot be measured by stats. Not sure why you imply otherwise. I use stats to evaluate what can be tracked by numbers, or when others make claims that are blatantly opposite to what the actual facts (stats) say.

he's not drawing a ton of walks but his OBP has been consistenly 100 pts better than his BA in the minors and majors.

The Trib is reporting that the Cubs will pay most of what's remaining on Barrett's contract. As a Hendry supporter, (there aren't many of us on this board) this deal doesn't make any sense to me unless they're setting up another trade.

Rynox I noticed that in the other thread. I think the good plate discipline reaction comes from the differentail between his average and OBP in his ML plate appearances. Nice OBP for what a crummy average he's had.

Rob: Where are you getting the patience thing? The scouting report I read said he had poor plate discipline, and he's struck out roughly one in four at bats through his minor league career. His OBP in the minors is in the .320 range -- not exactly stellar, especially when matched with a sub .400 SLG.

I keep hearing references to Bowen’s patience at the plate, but the scouting reports say he has poor plate discipline. Hmmm... not sure where the scouting reports get that, as he has always shown patience: Minors (ave/obp): .238/.324 Majors:.206/.298 A 90 point difference in ave/obp shows good patience. Of course, patience isn't so helpful when you are hitting .206, or even .238.

dave: "…plays that simply do not show up anywhere in stats." Anyone know if there's a stat somewhere that shows the relative importance of defensive miscues? Kind of like an ERA for errors or something? For example, Barrett's throw into leftfield before the fight would be weighted more heavily than a throwing error to first with 2 outs and no one on base that led to 0 runs scored. If something like that exists, I'd love to see it.

There's a genius poll on ESPN.com. Who is most to blame for the Cubs problems? Barrett is one of the choices.

Rob G.: "You think that based off absolutely nothing and your theory is full of s***. " Well, thanks for your theory...

dave: Not sure why you imply otherwise. I'm not implying anything... I just like to bust your balls because you like the stats and I only like stats a little bit. I meant it in a fun-spirited way, I hope you weren't offended.

I think the team will be better just with the subtraction of Barrett's poor defense. It doesn't matter what the catchers hit, as long as they can field at average or above average levels this is an improvement. That said, Bowen's career stats for throwing out runners in the majors is horrible, 5 for 50.Hopefully that's because the SD pitchers never held anyone on, but he did have similar poor stats throwing out only 11% of runners when he was in Minnesota. Bowen has seemed to hit well against us. My biggest bitch with Barrett, besides his erratic throwing, was his pitch location. Even if the bench was calling some of the pitches, which it's been clear they have since Barrett arrived, Barrett's location he offers with his glove is often completely bone-headed, and that's something the coaches on the bench can't call. Barrett was good for at least two baserunners a game advancing to second base that shouldn't have happened. So if we just have average defensive catchers that should be an improvement. I don't look at Bowen as any long term answer, nor Hill. I don't think either is a stud defensive catcher. Hill himself said on Santo's pregame show a couple of weeks ago that he's always been considered an offensive catcher and he gets here and everyone is calling him a defensive catcher. I suspect that the Cubs wanted, they could find a top defensive catcher who can't hit and is stuck in someone's minor leagues, just like there are normally a handful of great glove, no-hit shortstops stuck in the minors.

Rob G, just an FYI you have him listed as Tyler Burke in your post, and it is actually Kyler Burke

There’s a genius poll on ESPN.com. Damn... I thought I could take the poll and find out if I was a genius... I meant it in a fun-spirited way, I hope you weren’t offended. Nope... not offended.

I saw that poll too, Horatio - Barrett - Z - Lou - Injuries Any chance I can just pick Bristol, CT? Mo-rons...

My mind is off on a tangent...I have a stat question and wonder if anyone has done the research. Is reaching base via error a skill? I mean, do some guys (for instance, fast guys or guys who hit lots of grounders) get on via error more often than guys who don't? Or are errors pretty much randomly distributed.

Levine says the Cubs will pick up appx half of what remains on Barrett's contract this season.

RobR: "From an outsider’s point of view this seems to be a straight dump of Barrett, " Exactly!!! Cubnut: "Buster Olney of ESPN is reporting that the Cubs have traded catcher Michael Barrett to the Padres in exchange for catcher Rob Bowen, a minor league pitcher and cash." "Rob G.: "and depending on the money, which is at least over a $1 million, there’s probably some room to make another deal if needed." Hey guys, ESPN is reporting that we are sending the Padres money, not them sending us money. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2910079 "The Padres also will receive cash considerations from the Cubs" On paper this is a very bad trade, a clear dump of Barrett.

I was puzzled at the time and even more puzzled now that the Cubs didn't draft the catcher from Georgia Tech. I don't know when they decided to get rid of Barrett, but either way, with the lack of good catching prospects in the organization and Barretts pending free agency and now trade, Weiters should have been the pick. To me this shows once again that Hendry reacts to things that happen rather than being capable of any strategic planning and that is a main reason we are where we are.

I still think K. Hill can hit (although R. Hill can't), but in any case, the number eight slot in the batting order was made for catchers. Ask the Cardinals, who won the Series last year with a catcher who batted .216 during the season. (But it was bittersweet, because what they really wanted was the Silver Slugger trophy.) When Aramis comes back, DeRosa will have to move to short, since Fontenot isn't going to budge. The batting order one to seven will be solid.

I've seen Bowen catch enough to know that he is at least solid fundamentally behind the plate. I have seen high school catchers with better mechanics than Barrett. I could never understood why Barrett could not or would not work to develop basic catching fundamentals. I am no Hendry fan but I believe it is the best deal he could have made..

Barrett was good for at least two baserunners a game advancing to second base that shouldn’t have happened. Seriously? Don't make things up... Barrett has had 32 runners steal on him this year, in 54 (51 starts) games. That is much less than one a game. So while Barrett has been down right bad throwing out runners this year, it doesn't help your argument to make up stats that are not true about the guy.

It's not a dump. It appears that Lou (like many around here, note) felt Barrett's glove hurt more than his belt helped and so he wanted a young, glove-first catcher. That's exactly what the Cubs got in return, plus a prospect. Now whether or not that kind of trade is a good idea is a completely different matter, and one I happen to disagree with, but this wasn't a dump.

I have only been bitching for the last couple years how Barrett can't block pitches in the dirt and low and behold that is one of the reasons he got his ass traded out of town. It might have been fine to have a shitty Catcher on Dusty's teams but not on Lou's. I am happy and I am sure our pitching staff is happy as hell to see him gone. One of the worst defensive catchers i will probably ever see, he makes Piazza actually look like a gold glover behind the plate.

Any chance I can just pick Bristol, CT? Mo-rons… Seriously... how can a poll be about the Cubs struggles without even mentioned in the bullpen. DeRosa will have to move to short Not sure why you think DeRosa would move to SS, being that he has not played there once all year.

Hendry on conference call: * Happy with Koyie Hill * We needed to "shuffle the deck" * Bowen's going to be with us for a while * Starter decided on daily basis by Lou * Not worried about there being a hole in lineup * Scoring "will take care of itself" * Barrett tries too hard, leading to defensive lapses * Excited about Tyler Burke (enthusiastically reminds us about his status as a former sandwich pick) * "All of us thought Michael would be able to take one more step forward this year" * No pitcher said "I don't want Barrett catching." * Been in works 3-4 days. Good luck with that.

I've used this before here, but on occasion as a manager of personnel, I've ended up in a situation of making a less-than-ideal change. On those occasions, I have described it as "A bad idea, whose time has come." I read here several partially-explaining rationales for today's trade, all of which by themselves don't entirely hold water, but collectively...maybe so. Lou would have had a pretty strong argument for pressing Hendry for this change, as in, "Are you kidding me? The guy is in national headlines for dugout arguments, has shown that he'll track down a teammate in the clubhouse," etc and definitely would not be wanted in the toolbox of a first-year Lets Turn Things Around manager. I'm not sure at what point positive offensive contribution could have compensated for the negatives.

* I am going to go eat my doughnuts now, so leave me alone * And after that start slowly packing my bags for is we don't make the playoffs again, a new owner will see I am incompetent.

I like Barrett, but I had resigned myself to the idea that due to his recent slump and his continued poor defense, he wouldn't be back next year. I personally think Hendry probably could have got more for him, especially if he waited a few more weeks, but the negative attention recently surely limited his trade value. I wouldn't be surprised if this a setup move for a bigger trade, especially since the Cubs now have a surplus of very young quality minor league outfielders. I also wouldn't be surprised if this is just a pure dump, exchanging the poor defense, high salary, and above average offense of Barrett for the average (or even plus) defense, low salary, and average offense of Bowen. I would be surprised though if the Trib picks up most of the rest of Barrett's contract. That would clearly lessen the merit of this move.

If anybody here with access to mlb.com game archives has any doubt about the importance of pitch selection, I urge him to watch the Dempster meltdown in Atlanta on June 10th with Barrett catching, followed by Dempster's save the next night against Houston with Hill calling the pitches. Speaking of Slider Mike, what was he thinking last night on the pitch that Kinsler tagged for his second home run? Or, to paraphrase Z, was he out of his effing mind? Piniella did the right thing: yanked the pitcher and traded the catcher.

Dave-"Seriously… how can a poll be about the Cubs struggles without even mentioned in the bullpen." That would require research and thought. This was a dump of Barrett. Lou is wielding some power over there unlike previous management that would go into a coma and blame the media and umpires and hot weather. I'm hoping Hendry has something else up his sleeve, like I said I wouldnt mind Pierzynski here if they want to win this year.

and if the Padres end up representing the National League in the World Series with Barrett behind the plate how will the Cubs feel...? It's possible that Hendry will have helped send a missing piece of the puzzle to a National League contender (and we're paying for most of Barrett's salary too)....hmmmm....does this really make sense...??

Hendry's first gift to young Rob Bowen to help him build his confidence... Kameron Loe at Arlington.

especially since the Cubs now have a surplus of very young quality minor league outfielders. Not sure that Burke fits under "quality," nor am I sure that the Cubs have a surplus of said quality minor league outfielders. * Excited about Tyler Burke (enthusiastically reminds us about his status as a former sandwich pick) You mean... the pick that the Cubs could have gotten next year because they didn't re-sign Barrett?

Bogey said: Levine says the Cubs will pick up appx half of what remains on Barrett’s contract this season. Once again, one of our bargain players turns out not to be such a bargain.

Not true, L.A. ... we all know Milwaukee will win the Series this year... Boston, White Sox, St. Louis... just follow the pattern of "Whose World Series victory will most infuriate Cub fans?"

Well, now here's the problem. We've got our three or four headed catching conundrum, and these possibilities for 2008: Jorge Posada (36 years old) Ivan Rodriguez (36 years old, has a club option) Paul Lo Duca (36 years old) Jason Kendall (34 years old) I took Barrett off that list. Didn't figure he counted.

Barrett not behind the plate alone is an upgrade to the Cubs. Anyone else we recieved in the deal is a bonus!

If anybody here with access to mlb.com game archives has any doubt about the importance of pitch selection, I don't think anyone doubts the importance of pitch selection. But what some of us DO doubt is the importance of the catcher in pitch selection. Pitch selection is a team decision - made by the pitcher, catcher, and the pitching coach, with the final decision on the shoulders of the pitcher.

Not sure that Burke fits under “quality,” nor am I sure that the Cubs have a surplus of said quality minor league outfielders. Considering that Burke is 19 years old, the 35th pick last year, and raked in high school, I think he's at least marginally "quality." As for the surplus, see AZ Phil's list of our OF prospects in the lower minor leagues.

Once again, one of our bargain players turns out not to be such a bargain. No... that is not necessarily what picking up some of the salary means. It simply means the Padres were using the negotiating power (i.e. the cubs really wanted to get rid of Barrett) to extract the most possible.

According to BCB, Levine apparently reported that the deal originally was for Khalil Greene and Bowen in exchange for Barrett, Izturis, and Jacque.

jacos: "I’m hoping Hendry has something else up his sleeve," He does..... a twinkie!!!

If you're going to look at this trade "rationally" you have stop cherry picking stats. Here's the real Rob Bowen Minor League Career 1655 AB's .238 .324 .391 strike out rate 25% Major League Career 213 AB's .230 .327 .376 strike out rate 32%

Dave Said: Barrett was good for at least two baserunners a game advancing to second base that shouldn’t have happened. Seriously? Don’t make things up… Barrett has had 32 runners steal on him this year, in 54 (51 starts) games. That is much less than one a game. So while Barrett has been down right bad throwing out runners this year, it doesn’t help your argument to make up stats that are not true about the guy. --------------------- Maybe you don't understand, it's not only his horrible career 23% rate of throwing out baserunners (18% this season), but also his 8 passed balls this season (30 in 4 seasons as a Cub), and by his poor pitch calling AND location calling, guys get hits that shouldn't. Look at some of the comments above about the difference in Dempster with Barrett catching and with Hill catching. BTW, in 3 1/2 seasons with the Cubs Barrett allowed 263 stolen bases.

More than half hate the trade, but did anyone actually want to resign Barrett for 3/27 this offseason? Or you all just wanted him for three more months and a sandwich pick? Plenty of teams will give him 3/27 in December... none of them will admit it in June.

VA Phil: "Once again, one of our bargain players turns out not to be such a bargain." Yeah, Todd Walker was supposedly a bargain. Also, JJ is considered a "bargain" , but i am sure when he is dumped we will be paying some of that salary too.

Who would we have to bitch about if Barrett, Izzy and Jacque all got traded at once? That would have really been disorienting...

Another Burke scouting report, courtesy of Brewerfan.net: You don’t find players that are more exciting all around than Kyler Burke. Entering the season as a high average hitter with a disciplined eye, he has added power to his game, approaching single-season marks for home runs in the state of Tennessee. He has incredible offensive potential, and is a true five-tool athlete who also has good speed and a strong throwing arm from the outfield. He also has made a name for himself on the mound as a left-handed pitcher, touching 93 on occasion and consistently working in the 88-90 mph range with a promising breaking ball. Burke’s commitment to Vanderbilt may scare some big-league clubs away on draft day, but his talents on the field won’t. Obviously, this was before he hit .209 last year and .211 thus far this year.

Mike Murphy on WSCR right now. Love him or hate him, usually interesting Cub broadcast... Direct quote from NOW: "If you don't like this trade, you don't like Lou Pinella. You like the old regime."

Maybe you don’t understand ... No... I understand. You are making something up (i.e. Barrett allows at least two runners a game to advance to second) in order to bash a player, even though what you are making up has little connection to facts. You are simply making it up.

Pudge Rodriguez will retire with the Tigers - he loves the Manager and the owner and has worked well with their young pitching staff. Pudge also makes about $10M/yr. I can't believe the Yankees will let Posada go as he has performed very well for them...with the Yankees payroll they can keep any player they want to sign. Not sure what the Cubs will do next year...depends on the new ownership, a possible new GM, and the payroll that is set for 2008.

OK, Here's my bet: Michael Barrett catches more post season games than Hill and this newest scrub combined. Any takers? Zambrano, you better keep the 1 hitters going, or guess what, you're next.

dave said: Pitch selection is a team decision - made by the pitcher, catcher, and the pitching coach, with the final decision on the shoulders of the pitcher. Larry Rothschild said this a couple of days ago:
“Years ago it was different. In today’s world, for whatever reason, pitchers don’t shake off catchers a whole lot."
In other words, if you want the right pitch in the right location, better talk to the catcher.

#128 Frisco..............Stolen bases are not the only mark of a bad catcher. Barrett just has bad mechanics.

Oh Frisco, if you only knew that pitchers shake off pitches they don't want. Especially catchers they don't have a lot of confidence in. A catcher's sign is a suggestion for almost every ballclub at every level. It's not mandatory unless it comes from the dugout.

"Barrett just has bad mechanics." I don't care if he stood on his head when he caught, what the hell does 'bad mechanics' have to do with anything? Sure he hit 54 home runs last year, but that's an ugly swing. This whole 'he calls a bad game' thing is a pile. VA Phil the other day was stating how Hill was a genius for standing up when calling for a high fastball, this is a move if Barrett didn't invent, he's pretty much trademarked. Dempster, Lilly, Zambrano all said they like him. Maybe you think it's a grand conspiracy theory, or maybe, just maybe, you don't know what you're talking about.

I get to work and I'm told the news by a Cub fan employee. I come here and there are already 139 posts. WOW. I don't know if its been said before here but this is just the first trade of a big move coming. We just lost a bat and our offense needs more bats. So? So expect Migeul Tejada to be in Chicago before 7/31. Mark it down.

I associate myself with E-Man and Murphy in #133. The Cubs are trying to fix what's broken. They're actually getting better, day by day. A few weeks ago they were sinking. Now they're treading water. Maybe at some point they'll start swimming or sailing.

and where the catcher sets up isn't that big of a deal, either. If he isn't setup where I want him, I step off the rubber. He comes out and we talk about it. Don't excuse poor pitching on poor pitch calling and where the catchers setup. Pitchers make the decision.

Might be right, Chad. I like that thought. A lot. I'm hedging my bet there or on the Griffey for Jacque & Gallagher/Marshall deal. I think Krivsky would be stupid to trade away the only thing selling tickets (Jr's chase for 600), but if he wants to dump, he'll dump anyway.

Maddux also said he liked or didn't mind Barrett catching him, and Maddux is notoriously picky about his catchers. I'd also wager that the Pad's GM ran this by Maddux before he made the deal.

Maddux may have said that....but who ended up catching Maddux most of the time? Actions speak louder than words. Nice try though.

"Maddux also said he liked or didn’t mind Barrett catching him, and Maddux is notoriously picky about his catchers" Than why did he have Blanco catch for him for the majority of his games?

I wonder if one of the "silent" beneficiaries of this trade is Scott Eyre. If Eyre's problem was "no confidence" rather than a sore arm or bad mechanics, a catcher who knows how to call a game and put his mitt in the proper spot just might make him useful again...naw, probably not...what the hell am I thinkin'

There is also this nugget from a Yahoo article... Barrett also was involved in a heated discussion with starter Rich Hill in the dugout during the fourth inning of a loss to the Seattle Mariners on June 12. I must of missed that. Michael Barrett making friends left and right on the team! Good riddance to the mental retard. You know your catcher is stupid when he starts getting hated by the starting rotation. Ummm Michael if you make them all your enemies, they aren't going to trade the staff, they are gonna trade you. *shakes head* Wow, what an idiot.

Uh, check the splits. Other than '04 where Bako caught Maddux almost exclusively, Barrett caught the majority of Maddux' starts.

And the Hill/Barrett thing, for the 1000th time, is bullshit. Everyone involved said afterwards that Hill was yelling at himself about making a bad pitch. But hey, who gives a shit about the truth.

Andy MacPhail hired by the Orioles. Welcome to 10 more years of losing Orioles fans. If you absolutely need a player....Andy will never get him.

But hey vorare who gives a shit about Barrett being a lousy catcher. Obviously Lou cares, cuz he aint on the team anymore.

Maddux may have said that….but who ended up catching Maddux most of the time? Than why did he have Blanco catch for him for the majority of his games? Sorry to trouble you guys with things like facts, but Barrett actually caught the vast majority of Maddux's starts as a Cub last year. Blanco only caught 8 of Maddux's 22 Cub starts in 2006, and 3 of those were during Barrett's suspension. Maddux got a personal catcher in 2004, but Barrett did most of his games in 2005 and 2006.

and when is the last time steve stone said ANYTHING positive a move that the cubs made? I believe he really liked the Izturis trade... A year before he was really talking Cesar up... Take that for what it's worth...

dave — June 20, 2007 @ 9:43 am Burke was a 1st round pick last year. It seems far fetched to think they are going to put him on the mound now? Why is it far fetched? AZ Phil already pointed out the several other players who have been moved to the mound, but you also need to remember that Burke was also a highly touted pitcher coming out of high school. SD made the decision to have him focus on playing the OF - the Cubs could decide to have him pitch instead. .......................................................................... Dave and Phil, I would say that it would be far fetched because the kid was a 1st rounder LAST year. If the cubs were looking to get a pitcher out of the deal they would have gotten one instead of this guy. SD invested 950K and a 1st rounder in this kid less than a year ago. One has to assume that they would part with a further advanced AA type guy before cutting bait with Burke.

MikeC: "You know your catcher is stupid when he starts getting hated by the starting rotation. Ummm Michael if you make them all your enemies, they aren’t going to trade the staff, they are gonna trade you. *shakes head* Wow, what an idiot." Hey, Rob G. you care to comment on this?? :)

Why does it seem like Jim Hendry is the master of selling when a player is at his lowest value?

One of the funniest things about this is that Barrett's "pitchers hate him" reputation started in '04 when Prior pitched better with Bako than with Barrett. Prior was still the Golden Child at that point, so group of Cubs fans decided that his struggles were all Barrett's fault. Good thing Gabor got him turned around, eh?

Hey if you love Barrett so much go be a Padre's fan now. I am happy as hell to get rid of the 3rd baseman trying to impersonate a catcher.

I agree with AZ Phil that the origin of this move goes back to Lou's meeting with Cubs upper management 2-3 weeks ago. I've been expecting a similar announcement on Jack and Eyre since then. But let's take a moment and review what Lou has accomplished in less than 70 games, that Dusty couldn't or didn't want to try for 4 years: Eyre couldn't get anybody out - moved to garbage time in the pen, recall Marmol. (Trade pending). Murton couldn't play OF or run the bases - enjoying the summer in Iowa. Izturis couldn't hit water falling out of a boat - watching Theriot play SS more than he starts while Fontenot plays 2B at least 3-4 starts a week. Barrett couldn't catch rain behind the plate and wasn't hitting .305 anymore - traded for the best C available AT THIS MOMENT. Jack Jones couldn't play OF or hit a bull in the ass with a broom - Pie recalled to catch everything in the black hole between Soriano and Cliffy. A couple of other observations, Lou is going to suffer fools who can't field a position, run the bases, or throw balls everywhere but over the plate. Also, let's face facts on Barrett - Hendry gambled (and lost) that MB could make the next adjustment in his game and/or still hit close to .300 - he didn't. He's a free agent after the season and some idiot team will give him the 6-8MM he's looking for - thank God it won't be the Cubs. Bowen and Kyler Burke is about what you get in return from a guy who'll be a FA in less than 4 months. Also, wasn't Barrett's ERA with starting pitchers something like 1.5 runs more than Blanco/Bako/et al? You better be hitting more than .300 and driving in 75+ runs if that's really true. I like the moves Lou has been pushing fo.

# 161 -- MikeC: Exactly. Some people are putting out the argument that a catcher hitting for power is a rare and wonderful thing. Of course, the problem with that argument is that Barrett is NOT a catcher. It takes more than catcher's gear and the ability to squat to call yourself a catcher.

anyone out there have an idea about how long it might take for a new catcher to adequately learn his pitchers in order to catch them effectively?

George Altman -- 163: Also, wasn’t Barrett’s ERA with starting pitchers something like 1.5 runs more than Blanco/Bako/et al? You better be hitting more than .300 and driving in 75+ runs if that’s really true. Sure, Maddux and other Cubs pitchers said nice things about Barrett. I'll do what I usually do: Ignore what baseball players say and look at the facts. IMO, the differential in ERA of Cubs pitchers based on who is catching is a damning stat for Barrett.

There wasn't a difference last year in catcher ERA. Actually, Barrett was slightly lower. We had this discussion in the offseason. That is a misconception that you are perpetuating.

wasn’t Barrett’s ERA with starting pitchers something like 1.5 runs more than Blanco/Bako/et al? No.

This is from one of Manny's comment a way's back: 2006: Barrett - 4.57 CERA and .191 CS% Blanco - 4.98 CERA and .429 CS% 2005: Barrett - 4.45 CERA and .231 CS% Blanco - 3.58 CERA and .487 CS% 2004: Barrett - 3.88 CERA and .250 CS% Bako - 3.53 CERA and .294 CS% 2003: Barrett - 4.26 CERA and .385 CS% Schneider - 3.75 CERA and .529 CS% 2002: Barrett - 3.75 CERA and .289 CS% Schneider - 4.37 CERA and .435 CS% 2001: Barrett - 4.58 CERA and .195 CS% Schneider - 4.03 CERA and .500 CS%

Of course... it is absolutely necessary to point out that CERA is a worthless stat that tells us VERY little.

For example... if you are looking at CERA - Barrett went from handling pitchers worse than Schneider, to better than Schneider, to worse than Schneider, all within 3 years. Crazy, eh?

Mike, I don't even like Barrett that much. I do think he's a net positive, but I would much rather have a guy like Mauer, Martinez, or even Martin. I just can't freaking stand the way he's made into a scapegoat for this team. He doesn't injure pitchers arms; he doesn't make rookies or aging middle infielders get on base at a sub-.300 clip, he doesn't make relievers forget how to pitch, he doesn't make star players suffer freak injuries, etc. ad nauseum. Getting rid of him isn't going to be some magic shot that fixes this team. And the flat out misinformation is also incredibly fruestrating as well. Just look at how much bullshit there was in this thread. Ugh.

I predicted the Cubs would trade for Bowen, except I thought it would be Jones for Bowen... I predict Murton and Gallagher to go next.

carmen of the trumpet: since you were right on who the cubs got but not who they gave up... why not make your next prediction for who they get, not who goes in the trade?

Re #159 "Why does it seem like Jim Hendry is the master of selling when a player is at his lowest value? " Doesn't it make sense that you wouldn't trade a player at the highest peak of his value because he's performing his best at that point? Players on any team become tradeable when they aren't performing well (or if they demand to be traded). The trick is what you get on the other end of the deal.

ugh, Bill Hall grand salami in the first inning off another hundred million dollar pitcher gone bad.

Anyone know what hotel the Beermakers use in Chicago? They'll be in town next weekend. I ... um ..... want to get Suppan's autograph.

“All of us thought Michael would be able to take one more step forward this year” what a flippin moron.

Vorare- " but I would much rather have a guy like Mauer, Martinez, or even Martin." You mean you'd like someone like the top catchers in the game? Lol....that is funny dude......reminids me of how Costanza schemed to get Griffey and Bonds for the Yankees. Just busting your chops a bit....I know what you meant.

For this team to improve it needs to have a culture overhaul and that means getting rid of guys who cannot play the game smartly. I like Bowen. He is a above average defensive catcher, who is improving offensively. I have also heard he has plus speed for a catcher. Coming from the Twins organization, I am assume (of course Jacque disproves this) he is a fundamentally sound player.

Anyone know the most recent scoop on Saltalamacchia's availability? He seems like a bit of an extra on that Braves team...

barrett for bowen...got my ideal wish. sweet. bowen/blanco-hill-soto...works for me. got to the party late...182 posts to skim...wee.

I heard Steve Stone say one-two months ago that the Braves are keeping both Salty and McCannics.

Guess who's been catching Marquis, Hill and Lilly this year when they have done very well? That'd be Barrett. Revisionist history is such a ridiculous thing. People are determined to dislike Barrett, so they see what they want to see, which is why stats are good, because they counteract emotion. The fact is we got rid of a proven offensive player who was starting to come out of his slump for a potentially backup catcher who has never shown he can hit, who has done a poor job throwing out baserunners and stopping pitches, and we haven't created much financial flexibility because we're paying much of Barrett's contract. Maybe this catcher is going to be decent in the future, but isn't Lou here to win this year? How is getting a prospect going to help that? This team is such a mess with its combination of aging players with backloaded contracts and young prospects. There is simply no real plan right now. Either we are supposed to win this year, which means having proven players, or we're trying to rebuild, which would mean young prospects. You can't do both.

Jordan, Dave, et al: If you throw in ALL the other Cub catchers' CERA against Barret's CERA, Barrets' was significantly worse from 2004 to the present with the exception of 2006. Call it a worthless stat if you like, but there it is in black and white, from ESPN.com. Also, CERA aside, don't try to tell me that Barrett is anything but awful behind the plate and on the bases once he finally gets on base.

wow..once again a hate for things other than the players being considered has worked its way into the evaluation of the trade. who wants to pay barrett 8-10m to catch for the cubs next year? who thinks bowen sucks? that's 2 pretty fair outcome questions to this...we could speculate if more could have been had, but there are also those that think the only thing keeping tejada from becoming a cub the last 2 years is a phone call.

Call it a worthless stat if you like, but there it is in black and white, from ESPN.com. Sure... there are the numbers, in black and white. Unfortunately the numbers tell us very little. CERA is only worthwhile if you can compare two catchers in similar situations - i.e. catching the same pitchers against similar teams. don’t try to tell me that Barrett is anything but awful behind the plate and on the bases once he finally gets on base. Who tried to tell you that? No one is saying that Barrett is good defensively. But catcher's ERA sure as hell doesn't prove it.

i mean, hell...bowen is "boring". he's most likely gonna be a non-factor at the plate compared to the rest of the lineup, but he's gonna be cheap and reliable behind the plate without being a flaming do-nothing at the plate. no i-rod here...no mcann here...but hell, there's only 2 teams i know of with an irod/mcann...victor martinez is a pimp, but no one knows how much longer CLE will let him catch.

Oh... and 2007 CERA, since those in Urbana seem to like it so much as proof that Barrett sucks: Barrett: 4.04 Blanco: 4.17 There is very little difference there. And their CS%? Barrett: .179 Blanco: .167

Seems like decent deal to me. Career: Barrett .267 .325 .431 Bowen .268. 371 .439 Why in the hell are people whining?

My two cents about the trade comes from an email my friend just sent me. 'I don't know about anyone else, but I'm just excited at the prospect of not hearing "the ball gets by Barrett!! the runners move up to second and third!" followed immediately by "ahhhJEEZ!!!"'

CERA... paul f'n loduca's 03 year is all you need to know about cera...believe that's an all-time top-10 performance. loduca out there making pimps of nomo, brown, ishii, and one of the best bullpen's ever. its gotta be loduca, not the pitchers.

Wild Thing - maybe you should take a look at Barrett's numbers over the last three years. Do you really think that Barrett's season numbers are indicative of what we would expect from him the rest of the season? And look at Bowen's career numbers, both in the minors and the majors. Both players seem to be have exceptional years. And we traded away the player who revert to the mean and get better for a player who should revert to the mean and get worse.

Dave, Yeah, there's something in the water down here that makes us compare apples to apples instead of apples to oranges. Why are you leaving out Koyie Hill's CERA?

I know that this is an outlier type year, BUT: .325/.400/.556...8 HR, 41 RBI, 15 2B at AAA Iowa. Geovany Soto is 24....he's knows Marshall, Hill, Marmol, Wuertz, etc, and calls a decent game. Maybe not the best thrower in the world, but hey, we're used to that. Who did he piss off to not get a look?

Bowen doesn't need to suck for this to be horrible. Leave Barrett out of it and explain why there's ever a need to trade for a backup catcher as opposed to waivers or free agency. Trading Barrett would have been okay. Paying for something you can get for free in the offseason is not. Two consecutive winning seasons, btw.

Why are you leaving out Koyie Hill’s CERA? Koyie Hill has a 1.75 CERA. If you think that is indicative of how good he is defensively, you really do have something in the water down there. And if you think that CERA compares apples to apples, you again really do have something in the water.

my guess is that like Barrett in '04, they see better times for Bowen. if not, he's a far better #2 option than Blanco who I think may be retiring soon.

I don't hate the trade...I just think that, like Ron Galt said, Bowen is the type of player that you can get for free. Barrett should have been able to get more value in return.

According to Levine, the trade was originally more involved - Barrett, Izturis, and cash for K. Greene, Bowen, and Burke. I would have been fine with that too.

Dave, My point in refering to apples and oranges is not that CERA is an infallible measure of catcher performance. My point IS that if a person is using CERA to evaluate Barrett against other Cub catchers, then include ALL other Cub catchers. We don't seem to be on the same page here. Anyway, give me your address and I'll send you a bottle of clear, cold, Urbana water.

"Leave Barrett out of it and explain why there’s ever a need to trade for a backup catcher as opposed to waivers or free agency." rob bowen is not irod/mcann, but he's a starting catcher on more than 1/2 the teams out there just going off the top of my head. hell, would have been nice to get josh bard over bowen since he's a more complete package, but honestly, they're not that far apart. bard's a bit more steady with his arm and projects for slightly more power...bowen's not gonna get paid crap for 3 years (bard's in his 6th year).

Rob G if not, he’s a far better #2 option than Blanco who I think may be retiring soon. _____________________________________________ So basically this could be trading away a legimate #1 starter for a backup catcher AND we're paying a lot of Barrett's salary. In what world is that a fair trade? I don't care how good of a backup he is, this is in no way an even trade. Not even close.

My point IS that if a person is using CERA to evaluate Barrett against other Cub catchers, then include ALL other Cub catchers. So you are complaining because I left Koyie Hill off, in his huge sample size of 7 starts and 67 innings? Again... a 1.75 CERA from Hill is far from indicative of his defensive prowess. He has even said himself that he is more of an offensive catcher than a defensive catcher. He has never been a plus defensive catcher. The 1.75 CERA for Hill is exactly why it is a worthless stat. It certainly does not mean that Hill is one of the best catchers ever at handling pitchers, which is what it would say if CERA had any reliability.

Ron Galt: "Bowen doesn’t need to suck for this to be horrible. Leave Barrett out of it and explain why there’s ever a need to trade for a backup catcher as opposed to waivers or free agency. Trading Barrett would have been okay. Paying for something you can get for free in the offseason is not." Very good points.... Also we need to keep in mind we are already on the hook for $2.8 million for a back up catcher next year in the name of Henry Blanco.

Some dreck, having read through the rest of this dreck: 1. Barrett gets a free pass from me on calling games. I think that comes from the bench, plus the need for a whipping boy demands that I put the blame for that on Rothschild's shoulders since ol' #8 isn't here to kick around any more. 2. Barrett, up until this year, has been below average defensively IMO, though not as atrocious as some make him sound. Maybe a C- on a bell curve. 3. His offensive output has been strong enough to make up for his defensive shortcomings, by a lot, compared to other catchers. 4. He's been atrocious this year behind the plate. Simply awful. 5. I don't know why any of you believe what these guys said in the papers about the post-fracas fallout, either with Hill or Zambrano. Maybe they kissed and made up, maybe not. I have no earthly idea. But what was said in the papers was spin and cliche, and provides no credible evidence about the truth.

i doubt seriously you're gonna find a free bowen on the wires, btw. he's got a strong arm even if his motion out of the crotch to throw and accruacy arent always steady. he sure as hell can block and handle pitches at the plate. for a catcher he's considered and average-at-worst type hitter with a possible power upside since he's got a semi-burnitz type swing and he's a strong guy. he's a boring ol' catcher, but he's more average across the board than the extreme of bad vs. good you see in too many catchers. i mean hell, the FA "free" signing of catchers to replaced injured ones this year has been very far from bowen's talent.

Rob G.: "if not, he’s a far better #2 option than Blanco who I think may be retiring soon." Just like Rusch, he won't just retire when the Cubs are still on the hook for $3.1 million.

rob bowen is not irod/mcann, but he’s a starting catcher on more than 1/2 the teams out there just going off the top of my head. Well... SD did pick him up off the waiver wire, for free, last off season, because both Minn and Detroit attempted to put him in AAA. It is not like teams are knocking down walls to get the guy.

hell, bowen's been around the block...still dont take away from what he is. as of now i really dont believe he'd just float through waivers. he's boring, but he's utilizing his uppercut swing the past years and 1/2 more than he was. he's always been a decent ball blocker...hopefully for the cubs his elbow issues dont become chronic or he's useless...that's my only concern, personally.

#210 Can we leave Barrett's motion out of the crotch out of this discussion please? It may have gotten worse since the intrascrotal hematoma, but that's for another discussion on a completely different internet message board.

In their careers, Barrett averages a passed ball every 95 innings. Bowen averages a passed ball every 86 innings. Not seeing the defensive wizardry here.

"Can we leave Barrett’s motion out of the crotch out of this discussion please?" im talking about bowen, not barrett. when his elbow isnt "sore" he's got a decent arm, but like todd walker at 2nd he's not as fluid with his "motions" at the position as he should/could be. a chunk of it probably has to do with his size...6'3" is kinda big for a catcher.

Do you guys think Linebrink would be in a deal for Barrett, a guy everybody knew the Cubs wanted to trade.. During the off-season everybody talked about Linebrink for Rowand.. Towers would never trade Linebrink for a catcher who is having a bad year, with one melee and numerous discussions with his pitching staff.. No way.. I think it's a fair bounty, if you guys wanna blame someone for this loopsided deal, blame Zambrano and his anger

n their careers, Barrett averages a passed ball every 95 innings. Bowen averages a passed ball every 86 innings. And Bowen has a significantly worse CS%. Barrett - .231 Bowen - .100 Yea.. you saw that correctly. Bowen has only thrown out 10% of base stealers in his short career. But it is in 50 attempts, which is not a ridiculously small sample size.

Crunch-- My bad. Just trying to get an intrascrotal hematoma joke in there. Carry on.

Ugh... My skin still crawls when people mention the intrascrotal hematoma. Having Barrett on another team also means that we may hear less about that... The Padres have Peavy, Wells, and Maddux, which are three pitchers with slow deliveries. No catcher would have good CS% with that staff.

CERA clearly has everything to do with how well the catcher plays and absolutely nothing to do with how a pitcher pitches from start to start and what teams he faces when Catcher A is behind the plate as opposed to Catcher B. For instance, Z's 4 or 5 mph increase in velocity, ability to add, subtract, and, in general, control the 4 seamer has everything to do with Koyie Hill being behind the plate as opposed to Barrett. Duh. Silly dave. You should know better by now.

If we're giving Bowen a pass on his CS% rate, then we have to do the same for Barrett, because we've had plenty of pitchers with slow deliveries. And slow deliveries still doesn't explain Bowen having a worse PB rate then Barrett.

will the Cubs have to pay Blanco's salary next year even if he isn't able to come back and play...? Just wondering as I've read he may need surgery - the Cubs don't seem very positive about when he'll be back.

bowen's not gonna throw out a ton...he's had off/on issues with that throughout his career. he's slow, too, for a tall guy. he looks like he should be faster than he is. i mean, hell...he's boring. linedrive-to-all-fields minor power guy who can take a walk and block the plate...nothing special except the upside of how well he could take off vs. righties at the plate. he's more likely to get better with his bat than his D, honestly.

Johann, are you really trying to make case that Barrett is an adequate defensive catcher? He is not. The problem is that Sabreheads think you can measure defense with stats. You can't. We know that Barrett was not good at blocking balls in the dirt. This can lead to pitchers being afraid to throw certain pitches in certain situations. There is no stat for that.

Johann, are you really trying to make case that Barrett is an adequate defensive catcher? He is not. The problem is that Sabreheads think you can measure defense with stats. AHHHH!!!! Why do people pretend others are saying things that they are not? Who here has said that Barrett is an "adequate defensive catcher?" Johann (and myself) are not trying to say that Barrett is okay defensively. We are trying to say that Bowen does not appear to by much, if any, better. And I have been reading through a couple of SD blog, and the word is that Bowen is distinctly mediocre - both offensively and defensively.

Well put, Chad. I was going to say just that. Guys need confidence to throw the hook or the slider in the dirt and know their guy is going to catch it. We haven't really had that. And it seems to me that the same people who point to Bowen's PB's are the same people who say that Murton would play better with regular playing time. But I guess Bowen wouldn't play better with regular playing time because it's entirely different.

I agree Barrett was bad defensively, but I'm trying to make the case Bowen isn't any better defensively and is certainly an offensive downgrade. I'm trying to make the case that we didn't improve at all by trading Barrett. And the problem with us sabreheads is we like to back up our assertions with facts. It's horrible and annoying I know. People are claiming Bowen is good at blocking balls in the dirt and Barrett is bad at it. Bowen has more passed balls per inning then Barrett. So obviously Barrett is better at blocking balls then Bowen. In magical fairy land where you can just make up any assertions you want, maybe Bowen is better. But in reality land, Bowen has not shown at all that he's better then Barrett.

I know that this is an outlier type year, BUT: .325/.400/.556…8 HR, 41 RBI, 15 2B at AAA Iowa. Geovany Soto is 24….he’s knows Marshall, Hill, Marmol, Wuertz, etc, and calls a decent game. Maybe not the best thrower in the world, but hey, we’re used to that. Who did he piss off to not get a look? ======================= Could be a possible platoon next year with Bowen and Soto? (Soto is out of options next year). And a note about Soto-- he actually started hitting REALLY well during the second half of last season. His all-star break numbers were not all that good, but the second half is when he started turning it on. So he's actually been hitting really well for a while now. Or K-Hill could continue his 1.75 CERA and everyone else can just STICK IT, creating the inevitable End O' Subject. :) Kidding aside-- could comparing W/L records be an effective measure of a catcher's success? Like, comparing catcher's individual W/L records against the team's season W/L record? I know this is still a case of apples/oranges, but maybe less so. Or shouldn't we just look at their Win Shares (which does account for defense, right?). I'm surprised no one's brought that up. What are Barrett and Bowen's adjusted Win Shares? (don't kill me)

We know that Barrett was not good at blocking balls in the dirt. Hmmm... no so sure about that. From what I have seen, blocking pitches in the dirt has not really been that big of an issue for Barrett. His bigger issues are throwing and making boneheaded plays. He also struggles to catch the ball at times on balls that he should catch. But Barrett had definitely made significant improvements blocking balls in the dirt since he had become a Cub.

From comments at Gaslamp Ball:
That when [Kevin Towers] asked Mad Dog about the possibility of getting him, Maddux basically said "what are you waiting for? Go get him."
Not a bad endorsement, eh? I guess Maddux is okay with Barrett's "inadequate" defense.

how a person works the plate truely has to be guaged in person. its so dependant upon more than 1 person. if an outside curve from chris carpenter was the same as an outside curve from rick ankiel it wouldnt matter....but well...yeah. no, bowden isnt gonna throw out a ton, but he's not much of a defensive liability outside of that and his bat is pretty nice except against lefties...oh nos...oh wait, start your backup catcher vs. a lefty, blanco/hill...that'd be nice. not much of a liability as long as bowden holds up his end of the deal and he's able to be used in that manner.

Sweet Jesus, we need a subject change... I tried with the Kroeger news, but alas, it does not appear that VA Phil is on right now... Curses!

could comparing W/L records be an effective measure of a catcher’s success? Like, comparing catcher’s individual W/L records against the team’s season W/L record? I know this is still a case of apples/oranges, but maybe less so. This wouldn't be any different than CERA. It is very much apples and oranges. A catcher is not responsible for a win/loss. It is a team game.

heh...seems he's actually hitting lefties this year. still, he's so weak from the left...lack of power...etc.

I would be pretty surprised if Murton is not playing RF everyday. Unless, of course, Murton is getting traded soon...

I am a little more interested in what this trade means. Bringing up two people, and sending down one... Bringing up a pitcher and an outfielder, and sending down a pitcher... The I-Cubs now have Walker, Murton, Coats, Kinkade, and Kroeger in the OF.... Seems like a crowded situation...Who is going to get the playing time?

"People are claiming Bowen is good at blocking balls in the dirt and Barrett is bad at it. Bowen has more passed balls per inning then Barrett." Do you know the difference between a passed ball and wild pitch? The point is that Barrett is not good at saving pitchers from throwing wild pitches. It counts against the pitcher not the catcher. And what I'm getting at is that pitchers don't want to test Barrett, so they throw fastballs when they would rather throw sliders.

walker gets to be default CF'r, though he's not exciting...kinkade is the "old AAA teacher" type (pat borders, etc)...coats/murton/kroeger is a crouded OF for 2 slots and kinkade is still gonna have to play somewhere cuz he's also blocked at 3rd by moore so he'll steal time from everyone. should be interesting.

It looks to me like Kinkade may be riding the pine for awhile... I hadn't realized that he is older than i am...

Looking at passed balls to measure a catchers defensive ability is retarded. its like looking at outfield assists to meaure an OFers arm. Tells you part of the story, but no where near the whole thing.

See Chad, now you're just making crap up. You have no idea if pitchers throw more fastballs with Barrett then other catchers. It sounds good to you so you say it. If you truly believe that, then go through all the stats and find out percentage of pitchers with different catchers. Without that it's just a guess.

OMG if the Barrett trade gets us over 250 posts in eight hours, just imagine what the Prior trade will do.

And what I’m getting at is that pitchers don’t want to test Barrett, so they throw fastballs when they would rather throw sliders. Hasn't the criticism around here been that pitchers have not been throwing fastballs with Barrett catching? And Chad - breaking pitches are easier pitches to block than fastballs if they are in the dirt. And Barrett has been at least adeqaute in blocking pitches in the dirt.

Ugh. I was so excited about a trade; that there's finally something to talk about. After reading through all these posts...I'm bored again. I need a new trade, hopefully one involving an exciting return.

i think the thing pissing most people off, aside from those that think bowen has no/low skills or whatever, is that bowen vs. barrett at best is a wash for 07 and most likely is going to be a low to slightly negative impact.

JESUS! What is it with you two? I know you watch the games. We all do. With you eyes you can see Barrett is TERRIBLE at blocking pitches. You know who wasn't? Damien Miller. The guy was a freaking vacuum cleaner out there. How do I know that they don't want to throw pitches in certain situations? With a man on third, do you really want to throw a slider in the dirt to a guy who doesn't block them well? Would you throw that pitch? I wouldn't. Brenly and Kasper talk about this all the time. You think Bob Brenly knows a little about catching? And one again Johann there are no stats to look at. You cannot evaluate defense with stats. Dave, "breaking pitches are easier pitches to block than fastballs if they are in the dirt." Are you fucking with me? The point I'm making is that a pitcher will avoid throwing pitches in the dirt with a man on third and default to a different pitch. Slider in the dirt becomes a high fastball. It is easier to throw a wild pitch on a slider than on a fastball as you are intending a slider to break downwards. If a fastball gets away from you, then it gets away. But it is much easier to throw a slider past your catcher than a fastball. I am not talking about the specifics of how a certain pitch bounces once it hits the dirt. I am talking about the likelihood of a pitch to hit the dirt.

And ha... Jenks gets a blown save and the Sox may lose another one. Maybe TCR should adopt a new slogan - "It could be worse. We could be White Sox fans."

What are Bowen's CS% with Det, Min, and the minors? SD is known for not caring about base stealers.

Yeah, Joe, I feel the same way. Bowen is not a guy to get excited about. As everyone on here says, he is a boring player. He hasn't played for the Cubs yet, either, so I think all this discussion of the minutia of his career is pretty pointless. Let's see how he does when he plays. I am hoping that this minor league shuffling is indicative of further moves coming soon....

Are you fucking with me? No... not at all. Catchers tend to have a harder time blocking fastballs in the dirt than off speed breaking pitches in the dirt. Reason? You don't expect fastballs to be in the dirt, and you do expect breaking pitched to be in the dirt. It has little to do with the "specifics of how a certain pitch bounces." And yes... I really do think that Barrett does an adequate job at blocking pitches in the dirt.

Tejada, you say? We might trade for Tejada? We're getting Tejada? Holy shit, we just traded for Tejada! Tejada is the newest member of the Chicago Cubs, woohoo! What does everyone else think about this acquisition?

Bowen will crush KamLoe tonight ... 2 for 3 with a HR and a BB. Unless Hill starts.

Bowen's CS% for Minnesota: 2003: 0 for 8 (.00) 2004: 1 for 7 (.143)

...just thought I'd start things going early. I better be careful though or I might end up quoted as a source at MLB Trade Rumors.

Chad, you could certainly figure out how many pitches are thrown with each catcher. Finding out the percentage of sliders thrown to Barrett vs Blanco is possible if you truly wanted to move beyond guess work. I don't like guess work. It's another word for opinions and you know what they say about opinions. Without factual support, your assertions about sliders vs fast balls are opinions.

And Bowen never actually played for Detroit. Not sure if the minor league defensive numbers are available. I will try and see what I can find.

Sorry Johann but unless you are privy to Larry Rothchild's pitching reports you don't have any idea of what pitches were thrown or called for. Cause I don't trust some minimum wage stat stringer who works for mlb.com for an accurate pitch breakdown.

Lets see... Bowen's minor league pass ball numbers are available. Not that great - about 1 every 6-8 games. I don't see minor league CS% available anywhere, but I may be missing them.

Batting StatisticsYearTeamLgAgeOrg.Level PosGABRH2B3BHRRBISBCSBBSOHBPIBBSH SFDP AVGOBPSLGOPS 1999GCL TwinsGCL18MinRk c297710204001122201500130 .260.400.312712 2000ElizabethtApp19MinRk c217317213041900111800000 .288.381.493874 2001Quad CityMidw20MinA c106385479818218704037112222311 .255.321.452773 2002Quad CityMidw21MinA c521141000002400000 .190.261.238499  Fort MyersFSL21MinA+ c10034252631211049103869502512 .184.272.313585 2003NewBritainEast22MinAA c42134174113011600132420100 .306.376.425801  RochesterIL22MinAAA c3010514277061700112511003 .257.333.495828  MinnesotaMLB22MinMLBlog - sp c710010001000400011 .100.091.100191 2004NewBritainEast23MinAA c77249284910092430317631113 .197.292.345637  MinnesotaMLB23MinMLBlog - sp c17271300120041000101 .111.226.222448 2005RochesterIL24MinAAA c87262387013262502376842007 .267.366.401767 2006Lk ElsinCalif25SdA+ c27010000000200000 .143.143.143286  San DiegoMLB25SdMLB c949422235031301132610111 .245.339.394733 Major League Totals - 3 Season(s)11813123275041601174010223 .206.298.336634Minor League Totals - 8 Season(s)49916552243948155423110420041317671236 .238.324.391715

Here's an idea: Let's watch Bowen catch for the Cubs for a couple of weeks, then start to build an opinion on how he compares to Barrett. Okay?

Well, I disagree with you, but even that's true, that doesn't make your statement any more correct. We can all make up stuff we believe to be true if there is no way to back up our statements with facts. So, I'm going to claim that Zambrano fist pumps more when Barrett is catching him. Someone prove me wrong.

I'm going to claim that this back-and-forth about Barrett vs. Bowen makes me contemplate breaking something more than a discussion about Kroeger moving up to AAA... Someone prove me wrong!

OKay! Johann just said it! End of Subject! Wahoo!! Man, we really need a day game, today of all days... Anyone up for a caption contest? I'll look for a pic...

Can we all just agree that Barrett has typically (with the exception of this poor year) been superior to Bowen offensively, and that, while Bowen is generally regarded as a better defensive catcher, he's not considered a top-tier defensive talent?

i blame barre...oh wait...NO....NOOOOOOOOO...THIS TRADE CANT HAPPEN.

What is that sound? It sounds sort of like the wheels coming off... but... I can't figure it out... it sounds like it's coming from across town and the Cub's are away this week.

[I just thought a metaphorical kick in the balls might reset this conversation]

Aw, shit! I'm sorry, I didn't even click on it. I am tasting my lunch again...

Johann, once again. You think that everything can be quantified. If not, it means it's just made up. Look, you watch the games. Do you think Barrett looks slick behind the plate? Do you have faith in him that he will block errant pitches? I don't. I thought Damien Miller was great at it. When a ball got by him, I was shocked. And people like Steve Stone and Bob Brenly agree. Because they use their eyes to evaluate a player and not meaningless defensive metrics.

quantified. If not, it means it’s just made up. Look, you watch the games. That really is not the argument, is it? Where did Johann say that Barrett was a "slick" defender? What Johann is saying is that your claim that pitchers throw more fastballs and less breaking pitches with Barrett catching is complete BS - because you are making it up. Of course, you don't deny that. You just change the argument.

Woh... not sure what I copied there from Chad.. oh well. You get the point about what I was responding to, I think. If there is any question, this is what I should have quoted:
Do you think Barrett looks slick behind the plate? Do you have faith in him that he will block errant pitches?

I didn't change the argument. The point is, there is no stat that shows that Barrett is bad at blocking pitches. He is bad at it cause I watch him be bad at it. We ALL think he's bad at it. EVERYONE thinks he's bad at it. The Padres either think that they can fix it or don't care.

No... that really wasn't the argument. You claimed that pitchers are not comfortable throwing breaking pitches to Barrett. And we called BS. So instead you change the argument.

This is like those two guys in Ocean's Eleven that no one wants to get left with, because their always arguing about stuff... This game can't start soon enough...

Even with Barrett's "poor" year at the plate, he was still third on the team in HRs with 9. Another move needs to be made to upgrade either RF or SS if this is going to be considered a success.

Not sure why anyone would think Maddux wouldn't support the trade. Per Olney Towers asked him and he gave it a ringing endorsment. They worked well together for nearly two years. Keep in mind Barrett is a good kind of catcher for Maddux and vice/versa. Maddux calls his own game and can't hold runners on so Barrett's pitch calling and throwing skills are largely irrelevent. Maddux CAN use a nice bat in the line up. I don't like the trade but I am kind of hoping it is one of those that might actually benefit BOTH sides.

You've got to figure Hendry is still trying to trade Jones, as we were going to send him to SD until Towers backed out.

Weird Manny.... You didnt like the trade... What a surprise... I agree, we should have kept Barrett and his weak defense and allowed him to continue making bonehead plays, which cost us games... Oh you repsonse.....??? WE should have got more... Listen Mr Fantasy GM, Barrett was a lousy catcher... No one wanted him... The padres want him because there pitchers are great and their offense blows... They are taking a hit on defense for another bat... Get over it... Dusty is gone...

Matt... I am not sure why you are attacking manny when there are several us who are not happy with the trade. It does seem like the trade was uneven; many commenters on the different Padres blogs believe they came out ahead also. And I have yet to see anyone say that the Cubs got the better end of the trade here.

Yeah, Sheff. I can honestly say that I no longer have the slightest idea what side these guys started out on. I know they were arguing about Barrett vs. Bowen, but now they seem to arguing about who is arguing more fairly?

Jace (and dave), look at it this way. By each person disagreeing with the other, they are implicitly agreeing to disagree with each other, which means they're really actually in agreement, which should settle things.

On where Kroeger fits in at Iowa-- The Cubs remain a team with three sluggers, all righty. Fontenot has added some pop from the left side and Floyd might stay healthy and find his power stroke, but a lefty-hitting right fielder who can hit and hit for power has to move to the head of the class in Iowa. I'm guessing that Kroeger plays right and Murton left, with Coats and Walker arguing over center.

I know, Dave. I'm just replying to Sheff... Don't get me wrong, Dave. This is what this blog is for. Especially when there is no game going on, people find things to talk about or argue about, and other people who don't have anything else to say take pot shots at those arguing. It's fun sometimes. I don't mean anything by it.

Where have you been Phil??? I threw that out there hours ago! We've been in Barrett vs. Bowen/Johann vs. dave vs. Chad limbo!

Mike Wellman is expecting Murton to play in right while he is there, with Kroeger playing mostly left, and Coats playing center. Kinkade is hurt right now, so that leaves Walker, who is just struggling to hit in AAA. I like other opinions, though... Thanks for chiming in (finally!!!)

"No… that really wasn’t the argument. You claimed that pitchers are not comfortable throwing breaking pitches to Barrett. And we called BS." Not exactly true. I was saying that pitchers who don't trust their catchers to block pitches, don't like throwing balls in the dirt for fear of advancing runners. Just a logical process. I defy you to find one pitcher who would disagree. Then I say, Barrett is bad at blocking pitches. ERGO, the Cubs pitchers don't like to throw balls in the dirt. Its a very simple logic puzzle that does require a small jump in reasoning. However, the jump is so small that I can't believe that you are fighting it. Here's a fact: Carlos Zambrano pitches better this year with someone other than Barrett catching. "This is like those two guys in Ocean’s Eleven that no one wants to get left with, because their always arguing about stuff… This game can’t start soon enough…" I call that I get to be Scott Kahn.

Hahaha, Chad! It's been too long since I've seen that movie. Are they back at it in 12 and 13, too?

Here’s a fact: Carlos Zambrano pitches better this year with someone other than Barrett catching. Ugh... so it is Barrett's fault that Zambrano couldn't throw strikes? Or that he lost 4-5 mph on his fastball? I didn't know that Koyie Hill had magical powers to make pitchers throw harder.

dave, i never said that. I said that the numbers show that Zambrano's numbers are much better when Barrett didn't catch. My point there shows that there may be something to the fact that the pitchers (maybe only Zambrano) didn't like Barrett behind the plate. Or maybe it was a coincidence. Or maybe there were times when Z had to shake off a slider cause he was afraid of advancing the runners. Then threw a fastball that was hit. Jace, yes, those guys are in 12 and 13. I haven't seen 13 yet but they are in it.

My point there shows that there may be something to the fact that the pitchers (maybe only Zambrano) didn’t like Barrett behind the plate. Right... and my point is that you have no idea why Z pitched better with different catchers. Z threw an excellent game with Barrett catching here. Was that because Barrett did something differently? Did Barrett steal some of Hill's pixie dust to make sure Z threw a good game? You cannot blame a catcher for a pitcher's bad performance. How about this one Chad - pitchers threw better with Barrett last year than Blanco...

Mike Wellman is expecting Murton to play in right while he is there, with Kroeger playing mostly left, and Coats playing center. Kinkade is hurt right now, so that leaves Walker, who is just struggling to hit in AAA. I like other opinions, though… Thanks for chiming in (finally!!!) ============================= That's what I'd expect (Kroeger/Coats/Murton). Chris Walker is SCUFFLING in a major way. I actually thought with Kroeger's promotion, they might send Walker back down to Tenn. Walker = .201/.221/.245 (465 OPS) 4 BB/28 K. Not good. And another thought-- with the Iowa outfield crowded again (like it was when Pagan and Pie were both there), I guess Patterson is firmly back at 2B. Well, at least while Fontenot is on the big team. And that's something else-- who goes down when A-Ram gets back? Do you send down Fontenot? Or, a better option, is Jones traded by then? Or is Floyd injured? And who are we getting for Mark Prior? Can we get Cliff Bartosh back?

All the things that have happened with ramirez going down, Ward going down, have yielded some positive results that have shown some other players that can really contribute. When Ramirez comes back, it will really force the Cubs' hand. I think they really should be looking to get Izzy and Jones out of here by this weekend.

Wow, lots of posts. I will put my comments in bullet format: -- One measure of this trade is to put yourself in the shoes of a diehard Padres fan for a moment. If you were a poster on TPR, you might say something like, "Holy crap, we traded an interesting young catcher and last year's 1st round draft pick for a lousy defensive catcher who is hitting .256 in his free agent year?? If we are going to give up those guys for a rental, this is it?? Fire [obligatory GM reference]!!!" -- The most alarming piece of Hendry's press conference was when he said he made the deal in part to "shuffle the deck." If this was really part of his reasoning, it doesn't exactly inspire confidence in his dealmaking abilities.

I vote we package Kyler Burke and Jacque Jones to SD for Scott Linebrink.

Something tells me this isn't the world series season John McDonough was hoping for this year. These guys will never get the fact that paying big payroll for mediocre players isn't going to make them super players. This is a crummy ball club ---same club--different faces---different year....but not unlike all the other sucky teams from all but 3 of the past 75 years or so.

unless bowen falls on his face and/or his elbow gives out...looks like C 08 is taken care of...1 corner OF slot and SS is all that's left up in the air. yeah, a bit too early to blah blah blah on 08 (unfortunately it wont be 'too early' for long), but it seems bowen is being viewed as a solution for longer than just 1 season. blanco's healthy should play into it and etc, but its looking a lot like C is a done deal.

Well, he's a good guy, and he'll probably be playing in the postseason. Plus, he gets to live in San Dieago...

Chad, I commend your patience in re-re-explaining your simple observations to the saberheads. Numbers are not the only indicators of truth. If you open your eyes they can also tell what is true. Like Barrett's D costing us at least two games in the last two weeks. We should trade for Ken Shamrock, then we could at least win the fights. As for Murton, since he was demoted to shore up his RF defense, he'd better stay in right.

anyone got a list or something of the top of their heads of potential 08 FA SS's? and as another aside...anyone got the w/l splits on day/night games for 07 cubs?

One measure of this trade is to put yourself in the shoes of a diehard Padres fan for a moment. Based on the Padres blogs I have been reading today, most Padres fan really like the trade.

Like Barrett’s D costing us at least two games in the last two weeks. And what games were those? The same ones where he had an rbi single and a home run, respectively? You can't say Barrett cost the Cubs two games when in each of those game Barrett put the team in a position to win because of his offense.

I think people for get very quickly how many games barrett has cost us over the years... Baserunning Past balls Bases Stolen Never ONCE catching the fucking ball from the outfield when they threw it to him... I cant remember ONE time that happened!!!! Everyone needs to get over his "amazing offensive ability" He was batting .256 in his contract years and he sucks behind the plate... This argument will be over in the offseason when san diego doesnt even resign him and basically gave up two long term players for a rent a player... Who gives a shit For all of you thinking that Barrett was the difference between us and the postseason, you might want to reconsider smoking that last hit in your crack pipe... This team just needs to start playing better. There have been many world series winners with just a defensive catcher... Shit, our best success in the last decade was with Damion Miller, an offensive reject... Come on people, the glass is half full... There could be more trades in the pipeline....

Never ONCE catching the fucking ball from the outfield when they threw it to him Hmm... Soriano already has had seven assists, most of which have been outs at the plate. But yea... Barrett never catches the ball from the outfield. Try again. For all of you thinking that Barrett was the difference between us and the postseason, you might want to reconsider smoking that last hit in your crack pipe… I'm sorry, but who on this board said that Barrett was the difference between "us" and the post season?

Biggest problem the Cubs have had--and continue to have--is that there just is no offense on this very bad team. The cartoon character known as Sammy Sosa has more HRs and RBIs than any member of the 2007 Cubs. Think about that for a moment. Lee has turned into a judy-hitting 1B of near-Sean Caseyesque proportions. Yes, the BA is still excellent, the OBP is solid, but where is the pop? He doesn't run the bases well anymore either, and his defense is slipping. Aramis is a stud--when he plays. He has posted 145+ games started in a season for the Cubs exactly one time; and 2007 will not change that. Alfonso Soriano was a bad bad contract, and now we're seeing the results. A $136MM fiasco that the new Cubs owner is just going to love. Attention Mr. Cuban--you will need to eat Hamptonesque wads of cash to move this zero off the payroll. Cliff Floyd? He was pretty decent five years ago. Jock Jones? Haha. Felix Pie? Like his future, but that future isn't now. And then we get the great Mike Fontenot, Ryan Theriot, Koyie Hill, Pizza Pizza, and a collection of other stiffs to round out the lineup. Terrific! Jim Hendry-->never thought this could happen, but he may actually be a worse GM than Ed Lynch; Lynch was inept but didn't have the $$ to squander that Hendry has had. We are just plain bad.

Recent comments

  • Arizona Phil (view)

    There are two clear "logjams" in the Cubs minor league pipeline at the present time, namely AA outfielders (K. Alcantara, C. Franklin, Roederer, Pagan, Pinango, Beesley, and Nwogu) and Hi-A infielders (J. Rojas, P. Ramirez, Howard, R. Morel, Pertuz, R. Garcia, and Spence, although Morel has been getting a lot of reps in the outfield in addition to infield). So it is possible that you might see a trade involving one of the extra outfielders at AA and/or one of the extra infielders at Hi-A in the next few days. 

  • Arizona Phil (view)

    18-year old SS Jefferson Rojas almost made the AA Tennessee Opening Day roster, and he is a legit shortstop, so I would expect him to be an MLB Top 100 prospect by mid-season. 

  • Arizona Phil (view)

    Among the relievers in the system, I expect RHRP Hunter Bigge at AAA Iowa and RHRP Ty Johnson at South Bend to have breakout seasons on 2024, and among the starters I see LHP Drew Gray and RHP Will Sanders at South Bend and RHP Naz Mule at ACL Cubs as the guys who will make the biggest splash. Also, Jaxon Wiggins is throwing bullpen sides, so once he is ready for game action he could be making an impact at Myrtle Beach by June.

  • Arizona Phil (view)

    I expect OF Christian Franklin to have a breakout season at AA Tennessee in 2024. In another organization that doesn't have PCA, Caissie, K. Alcantara, and Canario in their system, C. Franklin would be a Top 10 prospect. 

  • Arizona Phil (view)

    The Reds trading Joe Boyle for Sam Moll at last year's MLB Trade Deadline was like the Phillies trading Ben Brown to the Cubs for David Robertson at the MLB TD in 2022. 

  • Arizona Phil (view)

    Javier Assad started the Lo-A game (Myrtle Beach versus Stockton) on the Cubs backfields on Wednesday as his final Spring Training tune-up. He was supposed to throw five innings / 75 pitches. However, I was at the minor league road games at Fitch so I didn't see Assad pitch. 

  • crunch (view)

    cards put j.young on waivers.

    they really tried to make it happen this spring, but he put up a crazy bad slash of .081/.244/.108 in 45PA.

  • Childersb3 (view)

    Seconded!!!

  • crunch (view)

    another awesome spring of pitching reports.  thanks a lot, appreciated.

  • Arizona Phil (view)

    Here are the Cubs pitchers reports from Tuesday afternoon's Cardinals - Cubs game art Sloan Park in Mesa:

    SHOTA IMANAGA
    FB: 90-92 
    CUT: 87-89 
    SL: 82-83 
    SPLIT: 81-84
    CV: 73-74 
    COMMENT: Worked three innings plus two batters in the fourth... allowed four runs (three earned) on eight hits (six singles and two doubles) walked one, and struck out six (four swinging), with a 1/2 GO/AO... he threw 73 pitches (52 strikes - 10 swing & miss - 19 foul balls)... surrendered one run in the top of the 1st on a one-out double off Cody Bellinger's glove in deep straight-away CF followed one out later by two consecutive two-out bloop singles, allowed two runs (one earned) in the 2nd after retiring the first two hitters (first batter had a nine-pitch AB with four consecutive two-strike foul balls before being retired 3 -U) on a two-out infield single (weak throw on the run by Nico Hoerner), a hard-contact line drive RBI double down the RF line, and an E-1 (missed catch) by Imanaga on what should been an inning-ending 3-1 GO, gave up another run in the 3rd on a two-out walk on a 3-2 pitch and an RBI double to LF, and two consecutive singles leading off the top of the 4th before being relieved (runners were ultimately left stranded)... threw 18 pitches in the 1st inning (14 strikes - two swing & miss, one on FB and the other on a SL - four foul balls), 24 pitches in the 2nd inning (17 strikes - three swing & miss, one on FB, two SPLIT - six foul balls), 19 pitches in the 3rd inning (13 strikes - seven swing & miss, three on SL, two on SPLIT, one on FB - three foul balls), and 12 pitches without retiring a batter in the top of the 4th (8 strikes - no swing & miss - four foul balls)... Imanaga throws a lot of pitches per inning, but it's not because he doesn't throw strikes...  if anything, he throws too many strikes (he threw 70% strikes on Tuesday)... while he gets a ton of swing & miss (and strikeouts), he also induces a lot of foul balls because he doesn't try to make hitters chase his pitches by throwing them out of the strike zone... rather, he uses his very diverse pitch mix to get swing & miss (and lots of foul balls as well)... he also is a fly ball pitcher who will give up more than his share of HR during the course of the season...   
     
    JOE NAHAS
    FB: 90-92 
    SL: 83-85 
    CV: 80-81 
    COMMENT: Was called up from the Hi-A South Bend group at Minor League Camp for the day... relieved Imanaga with runners at first and second and no outs in the top of the 4th, and after an E-2 catcher's interference committed by Miguel Amaya loaded he bases, Nahas struck out the side (one swinging & two looking)... threw 16 pitches (11 strikes - two swinging)...   

    YENCY ALMONTE
    FB: 89-92 
    CH: 86 
    SL: 79 
    COMMENT: Threw an eight-pitch 5th (five strikes - no swing & miss), with a 5-3 GO for the first out and an inning-ending 4-6-3 DP after a one-out single... command was a bit off but he worked through it...   

    FRANKIE SCALZO JR
    FB: 94-95
    CH: 88 
    SL: 83
    COMMENT: Was called up from the AA Tennessee group at Minor League Camp for the day and worked the 6th inning... got the first outs easily (a P-5 and a 4-3 GO) on just three pitches, before allowing three consecutive two-out hard-contact hits (a double and two singles), with the third hit on pitch # 9 resulting in a runner being thrown out at the plate by RF Christian Franklin for the third out of the inning... 

    MICHAEL ARIAS
    FB: 94-96
    CH: 87-89
    SL: 82-83
    COMMENT: Was called up from the AA Tennessee group at Minor League Camp for the day and allowed a hard-contact double on the third pitch of the 7th inning (a 96 MPH FB), and the runner came around to score on a 4-3 GO and a WP... gave up two other loud contact outs (an L-7 and an F-9)... threw 18 pitches (only 10 strikes - only one swing & miss)... stuff is electric but still very raw and he continues to have difficulty commanding it, and while he has the repertoire of a SP, he throws too many pitches-per-inning to be a SP and not enough strikes to be a closer... he is most definitely still a work-in-progress...   

    ZAC LEIGH: 
    FB: 93-94 
    CH: 89 
    SL: 81-83 
    CV: 78
    COMMENT: Was called up from the AA Tennessee group at Minor League Camp for the day and tossed a 1-2-3 8th (4-3 GO, K-swinging on a sweeper, K-looking on another sweeper)... threw 14 pitches (11 strikes - one swing & miss - eight foul balls)... kept pumping pitches into the strike zone but had difficulty putting hitters away (ergo a ton of foul balls)... FB velo is nowhere near the 96-98 MPH it was a couple of years ago when he was a Top 30 prospect, but his secondaries are better...   

    JOSE ROMERO:  
    FB: 93-95
    SL: 82-84
    COMMENT: Was called up from the Hi-A South Bend group at Minor League Camp for the day and worked the 9th (14 pitches - only six strikes- no swing & miss) and allowed a solo HR after two near-HR fly outs to the warning track, before getting a 3-1 GO to end the inning... it was like batting practice when he wasn't throwing pitches out of the strike zone...